In this special Pride Month episode of Fostering Conversations, host Amy Smith speaks with Jessica and Giselle, a Utah foster care couple, about their journey into fostering and building a loving, inclusive family.
- What itโs like to foster as an LGBTQ+ family
- Why belonging matters for every child
- How foster parents can support youth who come out
- The role of community, acceptance, and chosen family
- Simple ways anyone can be an ally
Visit the Utah Foster Care LGBTQ+ Resource Page
Transcript:
ep72_jun26
[00:00:00] Happy Pride Month. This episode, we’re talking with Jessica and Giselle, a local lesbian couple who shares their insights on what it’s like to be part of the LGBTQ+ communityAmy: Welcome to Fostering Conversations. I’m your host, Amy Smith. Today we have Jessica and Giselle who are licensed Utah foster care parents, and we are excited to have them. Thanks for being with us today.
Jessica: Thank you. We’re excited to be here.
Amy: It’s June, it’s Pride Month, and you are a local L-G-B-T-Q family, and we are excited to get your perspective on what that is like.
So tell us a little bit about what got you into fostering. Just give us [00:01:00] a little bit of background so our listeners kind of know who they’re listening to.
Jessica: Yeah, I’m Jessica, my wife Giselle is right here with me. We have always wanted a family. We’ve been together almost six years and we just, we always knew that we wanted kids eventually. As you do know, there are lots of ways for LGBTQ plus families to start a family, And we started really looking into all the options. We looked into adoption, we looked into IVF, we did look into foster care a little bit initially and. We kind of were thinking it was gonna go a different route. We actually went in 2023 on Mother’s Day. We went to the zoo where they were having a Mother’s day celebration.
And there were different organizations there. And we had gotten an email from the zoo and they said that someone was there and they were gonna be giving away. an IVF. To a family so you could enter into this contest and you could potentially win the chance to do IVF because as a lot of you know, it’s not cheap.
We thought, let’s go, let’s take our chances, let’s go enter [00:02:00] in and see what the universe has in store for us and. Actually, that’s where we met with Utah Foster Care. They had a booth set up. We actually ended up having a conversation there with Esmeralda from Utah Foster Care, and she was so helpful.
She spoke Spanish, which was helpful for my wife, who speaks Spanish. She was answering all of our questions. it really just sparked that interest for us and we hadn’t really. Actually fully considered doing foster care until that conversation. So that was really special, that, that’s kind of what started it off for us.
And then we became foster parents. About a year later. We had a couple life things come up. I got an injury and we weren’t ready to start right away. But when we did officially become licensed in 20, 24, about a month after we got our license, we got our first placement. And that first placement was who we just adopted in January of this year.
And. We also have his younger half brother that was placed with us as well last summer. So [00:03:00] we’ve just, we’re just growing and expanding and,
Amy: Yeah, I love that. Okay, so you’re saying that the booths work. I feel really good about this. I love that. I love that you guys went in with a different, like purpose essentially, and then your eyes were open to something else, like that’s really cool. So have you guys had any other placements besides these two siblings?
Jessica: No, actually they’ve been the only, only two placements. We were kind of one of the odd ones, I guess, that adopted our very first placement, so I know that’s not always the case, but.
Amy: It’s not, but you know what I’ve learned in foster care is that nothing is normal. You just never know. So I love that. That’s amazing. So tell us a little bit about the process of becoming licensed. Did you feel any barriers or things as an L-G-B-T-Q couple?
Jessica: I do feel like in some ways I think we felt more needed. I do remember pretty early on hearing the statistics that about, and correct me if I’m wrong, about [00:04:00] 30% of foster kids end up identifying as LGBTQ plus. So I do remember thinking like, oh, wow, those are crazy numbers.
And how special would it be for us to be there and to be able to have our start with foster care and to be able to just be there to even if it didn’t end up in adoption, we would’ve loved to have that positive impact. Even if it was just a temporary thing where there’s reunification as the goal, then we were happy to be there for however long in a child’s life as that was gonna be.
And yeah, I think we felt pretty early on that that this was a good place for us. That there was a lot of inclusion and a lot of , a need for just having that diversity and having that acceptance.
Amy: Yeah, I love that. I know that’s spoken of so much, and so to actually hear your experience that is what it felt like and was that I love that because there is, there, is a huge need for it. Have you guys been able to participate in a cluster, the group that, Around the LGBTQ community. Have you guys been able to participate in any of those types [00:05:00] of events?
Jessica: We haven’t specifically, which is awful. I know
Amy: No, it’s not.
Jessica: invited. Yeah, it is very busy. Yeah. And we have met couple of the people that help run those groups. They’re amazing people. And we do go to other activities and other events where we can, and it’s, yeah. It’s been nice though to know that those resources are there and that those other.
Activities are happening, that those meetings are happening. Like it’s, it is wonderful to know that, and I think that is, again, initially that is something that really was a positive impact on our decision to become foster parents, was knowing that. It’s not just, Hey, , we are inclusive of everyone.
They didn’t just say it on paper. They were actually doing the things that show that they care about the LGBTQ plus community. There were actually those things in place to help. We are very happy that they exist and
Amy: Love
Jessica: we need to start attending those.
Yeah.
Amy: It’s tricky, especially if you have younger kids. A lot of those are geared towards the teens in the community, so that’s totally fair. And life is busy. [00:06:00] Foster parents are busy. So I totally get that. One of the things that Utah Foster Care says a lot is that every child deserves belonging.
So what’s that kind of mean to you guys?
Jessica: the term belonging. doesn’t just exist for LGBTQ plus. I think that can be for anyone that’s different, anyone that feels outta place. And I think of course it’s especially important for our LGBTQ plus children that that need those safe homes.
And. Us being in that community ourselves, I think has a whole new meaning. We can apply our own personal experience, the things that were said, that were helpful, the things that were maybe hurtful, and kind of take what we’ve learned from our own personal experiences and say I. We’re never gonna be that kind of parent to our kids because that was hurtful or the opposite.
Luckily in our cases were was true that we both had very accepting families, very accepting friends and support systems that as we came out and as we. Decided, Hey, we’re gonna, we’re gonna start a family. We’re gonna do this. We [00:07:00] had so much love and so much support and a lot of right things were said, and a lot of right things were done.
So just knowing that, like we want to give that as well. All the love that we’ve already received, like we have so much to give as well. I think that belonging is important for every child regardless of
how they identify.
Amy: Yeah, absolutely. And like you said at very beginning, , we need to belong in so many different aspects. There’s so many clubs, groups, places to belong that, that every human needs, I would love if you would be willing to share, As foster parents, what are things that maybe we have a child in our care that comes out while they’re in our care? What do we do as foster parents?
Jessica: I think what was helpful for me specifically, I didn’t come out in my youth. I was much older when I came out. I was about 24, 23 or so. But I can imagine having come out as a youth and I can. I can imagine the anxiety, the stress, the the fear of, how is this person gonna react?
Especially [00:08:00] being in Utah, it’s a little more conservative. A lot of people come from a religious, background and unfortunately you hear stories and these stories are real things that happen to real people. And unfortunately, there are a lot of reactions that are not positive and that are not great.
Things that helped me and things that were said to me from my own family was just, this change is nothing. We love you. We still want the best for you. We still want you to get married. We still want you to have kids. If that’s what you choose to do, and we’re here for you, and just helping to take that fear away of.
Am I gonna be kicked outta my family? Am I gonna be treated differently now? Am I gonna, the things that, at least in my case, I didn’t ever think that my family would do that. ’cause I knew that they, deep down, they, they love me no matter what. But they’re still real fears. Even if you have
the most supportive parents or the most supportive, support system, you, you can still have those fears and that, that still exists.
So her experience was very different than mine and I’m grateful she’s sharing this. ’cause it, it brings a lot of. Insight [00:09:00] here. She did come out when she was much younger early teens, and she was living in Venezuela at the time. a cultural difference there as well as far as being able to come out and having a safe space to do so. and she, very much at the time her parents were not understanding, and unfortunately she did go through a period of, they tried to change who she was and they tried to, they sent her to conversion therapy. It was unfortunately that, extreme opposite of the situation that I had.
They’re at a place now where they are, absolutely changed and apologized, and they are present in our lives. They love us, they love her, they love our kids. So it’s so great to see that, there’s hope for youth that maybe don’t have positive experiences as well. But yeah. My wife then also said what she would say to, to kids in her care.
is to just not have expectations for them not set the expectation of you have to be this person. You have to love this person. You have to end up doing this. And I think that applies, again, not just to being [00:10:00] LGBTQ plus, but that can apply to not have expectations of you’re absolutely gonna go to college right after high school.
You’re absolutely gonna do this thing or follow this. This rule or be this way or think this way. , That is advice , that applies to other areas of parenting is I think take away some of those expectations of who you want your kids to be and just let them be who they want to be and who they are.
Amy: Absolutely. Something I would love if Giselle’s willing to answer is, what did she do, when she was. I mean, ostracized, it sounds like when she was treated poorly from that coming out, what did she do? What would she say to kids that maybe are having that experience of coming out and not being accepted, not being included, or welcomed.
Jessica: She said it was really hard when she came out she felt very isolated. She didn’t have a lot of tools or a lot of, examples or places to, to look at or to go to really feel a lot of hope. When she did come out, it was a really dark time. [00:11:00] She did feel really lonely and like she was the only one.
. Like she was trying to be changed. But if she could say something to youth that are maybe in the same situation as that, you’re not alone, you’re definitely not alone. And I would add that it gets better. I know that it’s hard to see that and hard to feel that in the moment, but look at where she is now.
I’d say things have changed a little bit,
Amy: Yeah,
Jessica: so things are are much better.
Amy: and I feel like the world is getting more accepting. It’s becoming, more informed. I think even just in the last few years really it’s more. I don’t know the right word, but people are more accepting. People are more informed but at the same time, it’s like even just two weeks ago, a friend texted me and said, Hey, my son is.
Going to come out eventually. We don’t know when, we’re really afraid that grandma’s not gonna be okay with this. And I said [00:12:00] That’s fine. He is still the same person to me, but, so she called and talked to grandma so that she could give grandma a heads up and grandma did not respond well, and.
I don’t know how it’ll go. This kid hasn’t come out yet and I don’t know when he will and I don’t know how it will go but it was a reality check to me that yeah, there are still people that are like, oh no. And that’s really hard for youth and I don’t know what to do. And I guess we just find the people that are supportive.
I’m not sure, if you have any insight onto that, I think it would be awesome.
Jessica: Yeah. I’m glad you’re bringing this up. Actually, one of my favorite things that I share with a lot of people is you need to look for where you’re celebrated, not just tolerated. And I think I got that off of an episode of Queer Eye, so I can’t take credit for that quote. But I, I mean, it just really resonated with me because there are, unfortunately. Even some of the friends and family members that said this change is nothing. We still love you. Things did change [00:13:00] and relationships did change from the time I came out to where we are now and, unfortunately you do, you have to choose where you are gonna spend your time and where you’re gonna put in your effort.
And family is chosen and for a lot of, people it’s not just biological family. And I think that’s so true, especially with foster care. We always tell our boys, they’re really little still. They’re not even two yet, and not even one. But we say, we chose you and we always will choose you and.
Just that idea that love is a choice and family can be a choice. Sometimes you get lucky and you’re born into a family that loves you and accepts you and will be the healthiest thing for you. But sometimes that’s not the case. And I think in those cases you get to kind of, you have permission to choose.
Who you let into your circle and who you’re calling family and who gets to be your aunt or your uncles or your parents or your siblings. You get to choose those people and surround yourself with people who really celebrate who you are.
Amy: and that’s hard to do [00:14:00] sometimes. It’s hard. It’s hard to. To choose those people. When we do live in a society, it’s, you’re tied to this, you’re tied to that. And so I love that. I love that perspective that you have I love that quote. Do you guys have it in your house somewhere?
Jessica: Good. I know I need to print that off somewhere.
Amy: You do. I love that.
Jessica: I
think
my said something else to say too.
Really good
she said so in her experience, especially with some of her family members a lot of which are still actually in Venezuela in some of the cases where, she’s had people that haven’t been as accepting and, a lot of times she’s noticed that these family members sometimes just speak out of ignorance, out of not not knowing anyone that’s a lesbian, not knowing anyone that is gay and has a family, not knowing, anyone in that community that they can turn to and ask questions or not having done research themselves or not having, gained knowledge about.
community themselves. And so luckily in some cases, she has found that sometimes just after a conversation of, [00:15:00] Hey, let’s. Let’s put our religious differences aside. Let’s put our egos aside. Let’s put any hurt feelings aside and let’s have a conversation. What questions do you have for me?
That’s something that we always try to be very open to. Questions. ’cause I understand too, people, this is new, a new concept for some people and a. I wish it wasn’t. I wish that wasn’t the world we lived in. I wish it wasn’t so hard to wrap your head around this idea of families looking different than the traditional mainstream family.
But sometimes just having conversations with people and saying, Hey what questions do you have that can sometimes help heal some relationships, and not in all cases, unfortunately but she’s been lucky to that has been the case in some of her family members.
Amy: as somebody that’s not. In the LGBTQ plus community I can be sometimes like I don’t wanna say anything wrong. I don’t, and it’s same with any community, right? I’m in the fostering community and people ask me questions all the time and they say stupid crap all the time, but I’m okay with it ’cause they’re just learning.
So I think that’s a really good perspective [00:16:00] that it’s yeah, if we don’t know, try to find the most tactful way to ask.
Jessica: Absolutely. Absolutely.
Amy: So that’s a really good perspective. I appreciate that a lot.
So switching back, just to fostering a little bit, what is something, that has changed you guys as a couple or as an individual? What has fostering done to your life personally?
Jessica: My wife, ed everything has
changed. Yeah.
Amy: Yes, she’s
Jessica: everything has changed, but for the better. I think. Our hearts have just opened so much more than we ever imagined they could. Just this unconditional love and truly, I mean, the word unconditional, I think that word gets overused sometimes, but. the actual definition of that word, not putting any conditions on these children, you do not have to be behaving. You do not have to be perfect. You do not have to turn out this way, or you do not have to become this per kind of person. I have zero conditions on how much I love you and it’s just been incredible to.
Find a sense of community as [00:17:00] well for us. It was one thing that I’ve talked about. I stepped away from the religion that I grew up in when I. Came out and I lost a sense of community when that happened. So foster care really helped kind of reinstate and helped us explore a new community.
And it’s been wonderful to have new friends and new new activities to go to and new people that we can connect with and people that are going through a similar experience as us has been.
Amy: Mentally unstable people as us.
Jessica: People are losing their minds just like we.
Amy: Yeah. This is so rewarding. No, I love that. It’s so true. That’s awesome.
Jessica: I think Giselle had something
else to
say. Placements.[00:18:00]
Yeah, she said that kind of thinking back to the like trainings and initially getting into foster care too. And I guess we’re kind of hypocritical ’cause I just said we didn’t have any, I think in some ways we had an expectation, to take some of those things we were learning and really be able to apply it to having placements and, oh, we’re gonna use this stuff to, this is good parenting stuff. , We’re gonna be the best parents with all this information. But really it became, the, one of the biggest change has been with ourselves and, really reflecting on who we are and the way that we respond to things, the way that we react as parents to certain situations and the way that we, handle just your day to day things. It’s been fun to, to see some of those trainings that we, again, we thought we’d be applying this to.
Okay. When your toddler’s having a [00:19:00] meltdown, teach them to count to 10. No we’re the ones counting to 10 for ourselves first, and then we’re, yeah, we’re the ones having the meltdown. But it’s been great though that it has really kind of instigated that change in ourselves. In a lot of ways trying to show up and trying to be the best parents for these kids, it’s really changed us at a level that is just more than what we expected.
Amy: Yeah. That’s so beautiful. I love that. It’s I fostered for years. We’re done because our house is full, but I always say it’s like the most difficult but rewarding thing that I have ever been a part of, so I love
that. Yeah.
it’s difficult, but it’s
beautiful.
Jessica: beautiful. Yeah.
Amy: As we just start to wrap up, like what would you say to someone that’s considering fostering, especially if they are part of the LGBTQ plus community?
Jessica: I think this goes for most foster parents.
Amy: Yeah.
Jessica: isn’t easy. It definitely isn’t. But it is. [00:20:00] At least in our experience, it has really been a positive journey. And I know there’s many years to come still for us, I think, in this journey. And, can I share a quick story that also, okay. I do remember one of our first trainings. It was like one of the in-person trainings. I remember them. In a nice way, but pretty bluntly saying if you have an issue with lgbtq plus issues or with those topics, maybe foster care isn’t for you.
Consider, consider maybe exploring somewhere else to start a family. Because here we, we need to give these kids a sense of belonging. We need to give them love and support. And I do think that’s something that also stuck with me and made it feel like such a safe place. And. In general, to any parent that’s starting out their journey, however it may be, it is difficult.
And I think even more so when you add on these unique challenges that foster kids are come with and they’re gonna struggle with things for their whole lives, that your typical [00:21:00] child maybe won’t. And, I think it’s wonderful that we have a place, though that really, again, practices what they preach as far as we need to be loving, we need to be accepting.
We need to make this a place of belonging. And I think I’m just rambling now, but I, I.
Amy: No, I love it. I agree with all those things and I think that’s really accurate and I think it’s really important for listeners to. Hear that from a real life perspective, and hear that’s real, not just the flag on the door. It’s different when it’s in real life. So I think that’s a really good perspective to share.
I think my last question, unless you have anything else you wanted to add, is if people can’t foster ’cause not all of us can foster. It’s a different path in life that a lot of us choose and it’s beautiful, but it is hard if they can’t foster. What are ways that our community members can be supportive of the LGBTQ plus community?
Jessica: That’s a great question. I think, you hear the term being an ally and I think that can feel overwhelming to some people. They think the very extreme end of being [00:22:00] an of being an ally of showing up to protests and going to the parades and marching, right alongside your lgbtq plus brothers and sisters.
And I don’t think it always has to look like that. I think, just making it known that you are a safe place, that you’re a safe person. And that can be done by little things of speaking positively about LGBTQ plus people and the issues that are happening on the news. I think it’s so easy to make your stance clear.
I think there are many subtle ways that you can do and I, again, I don’t think it has to always be, if you can go out and participate and be even, even more on that extreme end of an ally, great. But just know it doesn’t have to be that. Just sharing that you’re a safe place and that you love everyone and that everyone deserves love and that, making it clear that you’re a safe person, I think is really the best you can do.
Amy: Yeah. I love that. Does Giselle have anything that she wants to add on [00:23:00] that?
Jessica: She said Help, help also with kind of her last point there of ignorance. Just being someone that’s willing to have conversation with people that maybe just don’t know that, that still have questions and that, need questions answered. Be someone that’s willing to have a conversation with them.
Amy: I love that. That’s awesome. Thank you guys both so much for joining us, for educating our listeners, for sharing your experiences. I think it’s really invaluable information that we’re able to share. So thank you for your time.
Jessica: Thanks so much for having us.
Amy: If you wanna learn more about foster care, head over to www.utahfostercare.org.
Thanks for joining us. [00:24:00]
